Posted by docarzt on Wednesday, February 18th, 2009 at 10:19 pm - filed under Lost, Lost News - (154) Comments
Want TV News? Visit TVOvermind.comLost 5.06 is behind us, as is the long overdue return of the Oceanic 6. Time for you to sound off, vote your conscience, and rehash the details. Was 316 a religious experience for you, or just another number?
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This episode was all about setup. Favorite moment- Frank Lapidus: “We’re not going to Guam, are we?”
I’d really like to know what Jack had to answer to that question…
Five donuts says Charlie told Hurley to be on Ajira 316… and that he asked Hurley to bring him a guitar. Decent episode, but very slow in the middle.
Gotta be man! Makes sense. Think maybe someone told Claire’s mom about Kate and Aaron? That’s why she was so upset? That made Kate get on the plane?
I’d buy that for a dollar. Kate was also making good on Claire’s pleas to her to, “not take Aaron back to the island”.
Yes!!
Assuming that’s what Claire meant when she said “Don’t bring him back.” She never explicitly said not to bring Aaron back.
Exactly right. LOST loves to use undetermined pronouns.
Do you think Hurley will leave Charlie’s guitar in the trees for Charlie to find in S1?
no, it was brought there on flight 815 (in 2004)
But Locke finds Charlie’s guitar in the jungle (up on a cliff, if I remember correctly) … How do we know that Charlie’s guitar from 815 is not on the bottom of the ocean somewhere.
maybe the guitar case was just to recreate the original event that brought them there.
maybe charlie asked him to do that too
May be it was Charlies guitar that Hurley had to bring or have with him on the plane, just like Jack had to get something of Christian’s and put on Lock. What do you think.
I don’t think Hurley had the guitar with him when he left the island. That’s not Charlie’s guitar ( the ne from the island at least ).
So ben went to the marina to kill penny, keeping that promise to widmore – this will cause Dez to chase him. Dez will go back to Hawking and be following after Ben.
Or Desmond kicked his ass. Or Wilmore and more merchs were waiting for him…
I hope you’re right!
This makes sense to me….although a secondary reason would be revenge for Ben against Widmore over the loss of Alex at Widmore’s mercenary’s hands.
That’s exactly what I thought, though I hope Penny’s not gone.
I definitely think that’s what the writers want you to think, but my guess is Ben went to recruit Sayid and Sayid beat him down. That is why Sayid is on the plane and Ben is messed up, but isn’t actually dead.
Sounds almost as likely as the notion of Penny being Ben’s aimed victim
Maybe both ideas come together in the actual plot? Like Sayid found Penny on the boat (we’ve seen him staying behind at the haven) and stood guard when Ben arrived…
Would that make sense?
But why would Sayid beating up Benput him on the plane? Have they revoked his visa or something and are they sending him back to Iraq by way of Guam or something?
I think the answer lies in next week – the promo shows Locke speaking to the marshal. So, someone has probably pulled a few strings.
Actually, it appears they want us to think that happens in the future. He says, “I remember dying.” Don’t know what the actual context is, so we’ll see. I still hold to my Sayid theory, but I like the idea he may have been with Penny.
Did anyone else notice that the music playing in the background at the bar Jack was at (before getting the call from grandad), was an elevator-style remix of Lost’s love theme? I could be wrong, but the melody sounded all too familiar…
Notice that the woman that was with Sayid later on was in that same bar with Jack?
i missed it. shenanigans! thank Jacob for DVR’s.
Do you mean the blonde sitting in the background?
They are definetely not the same women. Two different chicks!
sorry, first has to be singular -woman-
Even I noticed that (consulting my bad English).
I too agree that charlie told hurley to go on the plane and bring a guitar (like Charlie). I think Sayid got caught for the murders he committed earlier in the season and was being deported back to Iraq (like Kate was). Ben was maybe taking the role of Locke? by having a handicap. and of course locke taking the role of christian. and I think kate became pregnant the night before they left, that explains why she threw herself at Jack because she knew she had to, as there was no way to conceive successfully on the island. who knows maybe their kid will turn out to be Jacob, I had to throw a Jacob theory in there somewhere.
that would sure make them the “Adam And Eve” of the island.
and in the first season if im not mistaken, didnt sayid say to jack “im sorry to hear about your father” after jack was checking him in? kind of like the arab guy said to jack this time. nice callback.
I was thinking the same thing about Kate. If so, lucky for her that it happened off island. We know what happens to pregnant people on the island.
I thought Ben seemed to be playing the role of Hurley, who almost didn’t make the flight. Sayid was definitely Kate, cuffs and all. Kate is more ambiguous. And Hurley was Charlie.
Arab guy sorry about your friend
How about Sun being Rose, sitting there playing with Jin wedding ring like Rose was in the Pilot. And does any one else think that Desmond is on the plain? We did see him in a pilot’s uniform back in Season 3 in Locke’s dream. Is that why Jack can’t go into the cockpit?
but wouldnt Frank not be surprised about going back to the island then?
Is it possible that next episode will show that Locke asks for Ben’s help to get the O6 back? We know he talked to all of them and they didn’t believe him. We saw in the preview that Ben is there when Locke hangs himself. Maybe Ben tells him that he will be “reincarnated” like Christian Shepard.
NO SPOILERS PLEASE
than why are you in a discussion for something you haven’t seen yet?
why is this something we haven’t seen yet?
316 aired last night!
i’m with Masheen – NO SPOILERS IN HERE!
Are we back to defining what a spoiler is or isn’t again…?
Come on – Chemicalroad is just speculating on what we “saw” as part of the preview ABC aired on Wednesday night…
Pretty mixed feelings about this one. I think it’s my least favorite of the season. For me it moved too fast, abandoning character continuity. I wasn’t satisfied that we don’t know 1)why Kate gave up Aaron, 2) why Hurley and Sayid ended up on the plane after they were SO adamant, and 3) what happened with Ben & Desmond and Penny. Maybe what I should say is that not seeing those things happen felt like a cheat. One or two of those gaps – okay, but too many for me. And there’s something about Jack’s…relief, is it, that doesn’t sit right? The whole Ajira thing wasn’t too convincing to me, either, and I hoped for more from Locke’s letter.
If it sounds like I’m whining, it’s probably because I am. There was plenty I loved – the opening was great, Frank’s “Guam” line, and the Jack-Ben gag about reading. And I’m charged to see WHEN our O6ers ended up. Like I said, just my least favorite of what’s been an awesome season.
I think some of the missing pieces may be filled in by a return to “classic” flashbacks in later episodes.
Yeah, probably. Hope so!!
> and I hoped for more from Locke’s letter.
I’m wondering if that (now torn and at least partially discarded) letter might have some “invisible ink” writing on it. Locke certainly witnessed that as a technique back in season two on the blast door map, and maybe utilized same to hide Jack’s “real message” from prying eyes.
If so, too bad Jack seems to have lost most of it during “the event” and then discarded the small piece he had left in his hand when he awoke back on the island.
Maybe. The Jeff Jensen video thing on EW had a bit about notes being passed with nothing written on them. Hmmm. Interesting idea!
It occured to me that the note may refer not to their conversation on the Island, but to the one they had when Locke came back (which we’ll see next epi.), so that’s a possibility.
I was convinced it would say “Don’t bring Ben back!” and he was gonna read it just the moement before the crash/flash …
I think the letter could have been to replace Sawyer and his letter.
My guess for Des and Penny: They go on a boat trip and somehow and up on the Island … like Des years ago.
I’m with Prof. on this. Where was the character continuity in this episode?!? As much as I loved the whole “return to the island” theme, there is no logical reason for the whole Aaron’s missing scene. Aaron is Jack’s damn nephew, and he’s gonna just accept that he’s gone without asking any follow up question to Kate?!? Sorry but that’s the kind of $#!tty writing that gave us Nikki & Paulo.
Don’t you think at this point, with all the history and crap that they have been through, that Jack trusts Kate more than anyone he’s ever met in his life?
Fantastic episode but im saving my best episode ever vote for next week. Cant wait!
So maybe Locke fixed the Frozen Donkey Wheel, which may have fixed the time shifts? But in what year was that? The last flash. It was before the DI made the Orchid station. And Faraday, Jin, and the gang were in the same year. As we saw at the end of this episode, Jin, and Faraday (episodes back, Faraday bumped into Candle/Wickman in the tunnel of the Orchid station when it was being built) have been infiltrating the DI while Locke is away! In this year, Charlotte will be a little girl. She may see Faraday after all….
…and that would mean that the O6 landed in that same year. They did experience a flash…not crash…
Yes, but some significant amount of time must have passed between the moment John turned the wheel and the moment the O6 returned, right? I mean there was a 3 year difference in what was happening in Los Angeles and what was happening on the island. So that moment when Jack, Hurley and Kate see Jin in the Dharma suit must be 3 years or so after Locke turned the wheel. Right? This is the thought I’m on but I don’t know if I’m right on that.
I imagine that much of the rest of this season will be developing what was going on in that 3 year difference in time.
3 years sounds right! If Locke fixed the frozen donkey wheel, and the time shifting stopped, then Faraday and the gang would be stuck in the 1970’s. And judging by the DocArzt 5.08 spoiler screen pix, they sure look 70’s. Faraday in the Orchad tunnel, 70’s. Jin in the Dharma love bus, 70’s. So by this line of thinking, we may see the Dharma guys arrive on the island! Awesome. And our gang infiltrates the DI. Sweet. So maybe Faraday will see lil’ Charlotte! Our Oceanic 6 did “flash”, not “crash”. Nice…
why would the three year difference mean anything if they are time traveling? Think about it.
Hey I agree with imfromthepast – the on island time flipping castaways, experience their own timeline, therefore the reappearance of the O6 to Jin, means that whilst the O6 have experienced 3 years away from the island, for Jin and the other castaways, it may only be a few hours, days or weeks since they last saw the 06. Their own time lines are relative to the individuals experience.
off topic slightly, (while i remeber to write this) – I think Desmond is “special” because of the incident with the Hatch implosion – specifically that Desmond pre-implosion, is actually a completly different Desmond that appeared naked, wandering the jungle after the implosion. My theory is – that the island “replaced” Desmond, to keep the balance after the implosion. put simply (excuse my naive explanation) Quantum Physics implies that there may be multiverses where every possible predetermined outcome splits into a separate universes. ie. every possible outcome in the universe exists in a continual “splitting” of infinite universes (multiverses). I believe Desmond died in the Hatch implosion, and the Island replaced Desmond with another Desmond from another (separate) multiverse. This is why the rules dont apply to Desmond. He is a construct from an entirely different universe. This may also imply as to the reason why the O6 need to return to the island. Their disappearance from the island has created an inbalance (matter wise) that can only be corrected by physically returning themselves (or their matter) to the island. However not all the O6 have returned, (AARON)all matter has not been replaced, and as Ms Hawking said” unpredictable results” have occured (ie. returning to the island in the past). This also may offer an explanation as to why on island conception does not take place. Newly concieved humans create a matter inbalance, that the island need to inhibit – ie. pregnant mothers die, as the baby creates more matter than has existed previously.
New matter can be introduced to the island (ie, Desmond, the Balloon crash, plane crash, Oceanic Crash) but only occurs during incidents – time flashes or Swan Hatch malfunctions, when considerable energy is consumed and needs to be replaced.
So am I lost or does anyone want to agree/expand?
It’s a matter of hours passing really…I mean, they’re experience flashing but how many hours have gone by since the 06 left? That’s kind of what I’m talking about. You may be right and it may not matter.
Agreed.
Replying to white rabbit:
The problem I have with the conservation-of-matter angle is that we have seen numerous examples of people moving back & forth to and from the island:
-Walt & Ben
-Dharma food drops (& indeed all the Dharma personnel)
-Richard, Tom, Ethan adventures off-island
Wasn’t the unidentified man who gave his condolences to Jack at the Ajira counter one of Sayid’s old Iraq comrades?
Hmm, according to IMDB, he was not. But he was in Vantage Point, so maybe that’s why I was thinking I had seen him on LOST previously, as he was in a movie with Foxy. Sorry if I confused anyone.
Again, this was an all important setup episode. Just like in basketball – neccesary to faclitate the big score. Not the best of the season, however in hindsight, it will provide an OHHHH-DAMMN moment.
I thought this episode was very much like the first episode. It laid the seeds for what is to come. I am very concerned about Penny,Charlie and Desmond. It was all to convenient that Ben had to run an errand after seeing Desmond and the fact he was wet and at the marina. I’m not happy with the road that is leading down.
Poor Penny..but Des may come back to the island to kill Ben…maybe Hawking and Widmore will help….
Anyone notice Jack was wearing the same tie from the pilot when they crashed the first time, in this episode when he woke up on the island in the jungle for the 2nd time
I did notice that.
I also like the shoe conversation with Kate.
What did we see Jacks dad walking around in? White tennis shoes also what did Jack see in the tree the first time around? a white tennis shoe. hmmmm
I think that the ajira plane crashed in the future, while the O6 got sucked into a the time flash and left the plane. It would explain the people who shot at the losties earlier in the season and why they found the ajira bottle at the camp.
How does that explain the people who shot at the Losties? Who do you think that is shooting at them?
Well, looks like it’s the other people who were on the plane, like that woman with Sayid. Right?
But there is still a gap to fill: There was no Ajira plane wreckage and where did those canoes come from?
Maybe the canoe came from Richards people? And maybe it’s a whole new Tailsection group of folks? But there really isn’t time for a slew of new island folk…I suppose it’s those cameo characters on the Ajira flight.
This may be way out there, but I thik that it could be The o6 themselves. To me it looked like they were only trying to stop the canoe. It seemed like they were only shooting at the paddles. Maybe to slow them down. Like I said- just a thought. Not saying I’m right…but maybe…
Well, I think the people shooting at them was, if you will, new losties from the ajira crash. Everyone who wasn’t the O6 on the plane stayed in the future.
That makes sense.
If you are holding something, you take it with you during the flashes like the compass and the rope from the well. If that woman was cuffed to Sayid, she may have been taken to the island too. I don’t know if anyone else would have been touching a former islander, but maybe more of the Ajira flight could be on the island now too. I wonder if Frank was flashed off the plane. I was hoping Walt would be on that flight too.
i am thinking walt was sitting in coach and we didnt see him. they were all in first class or business class whichever
there is a sub sandwich in hurleys guitar case
Is it just me, or was this the first episode to ever have an almost entirely linear storyline (no flashes – except the beginning)?
Might be (at least partially) correct. But I agree with dolce, considering a setup episode should be as straight & coherent as possible.
Besides: You’ve already contradicted yourself: “(no flashes – except the beginning)”
The entire episode went on a (not too loopy) cicle-line.
The Other 48 Days had an entirely linear storyline.
Yes they did.
Ben and Jack’s scene in the church has re-cemented my theory. I believe the island will be used to explain our gods and what we worship. We’ve seen science vs. faith throughout the series, and it’s my belief that a combination of the two will explain what this mystical place (Eden/Shambala) really is. Thoughts???
i dont think you are too far off there, considering that the garden of eden was supposedly in africa.
was the girl who was taking Sayid in cuffs replacing the marshall, or ana lucia?
how much time has passed on the island from when john disappears to when Jin is in the dharma suit and pointing the gun?
Doesn’t she look VERY familiar? But she’s not Ana Lucia’s mother, is she?
No, she is not Ana Lucia’s mother. I believe she is a new character. But clearly, that pairing of her and Sayid was meant to replicate the Kate/Federal Marshall pairing from the original flight.
Jin had quite the hair thing going on that he didn’t have in the previous episode. So it looks like he’s been with Dharma for a little while at least.
omg at first i thought Jin was Michael. I so thought i got tricked!
I am going with the earlier point made that it has been 3 years on the island for Sawyer, Jin, Farrady et al, since Locke moved the wheel. So they have been in the ’70’s for 3 years by the time Hurley, Jack, Kate et al return to the island. Locke visiting the Oceanic 6 and them getting back to the island etc…Jack’s bearded breakdown – that all happened over the course of 3 years. The show has fudged timelines though, with the on-island events that occur after the island moves, happening at the same time (in terms of viewing the show episode by episode)as the Oceanic 6 preparing to come back. They have been off the island for 3 years and there is a massive amount of things that happened during those 3 years on the island – will the writers be able to fit all that in, and when?
What interests me is what were all the ‘terrible things’ that happened/what would happen if the Oceanic 6 didn’t go back? Did they actually happen? (Jin seemed releatively ok and looked healthy, driving the VW van etc…) Will they still happen?
another question – what was sayid’s buddy doing on the plane? they weren’t sitting together, obviously, but they obviously know eachother from a few season ago, right?
I think they have never met each other before.
At least we have never seen that happening on screen.
Yeah, a few comments up it looks like some one checked on IMDB, and it’s not the same person as Sayid’s pal.
Loved the episode. Thought it started off a bit strange but it really got moving and the ending was really a mindbender for me. I’ll be though, that they all end up infiltrating Dharma and working within it…and in the Season Premier when we see Daniel bump into Marvin Candle, I’m seeing now how it’s all tying together. We’ll probably see that again and then some…
my only question is, and I’ve had this all season, is Why is everyone always saying that they need to be all together again to fix the problems on the island? Why does the Ajira flight need to be SOOOO reminiscent of 815? I just don’t get why the Oceanic 6 returning to the island will fix the time-warping problem. The two don’t go together.
Can someone please give me a decent, simple explanation. I firmly believe that the true writers of this show are somewhere in the depths of Docarzt forums.
I don’t think that the 06 returning to the island was meant to fix the time-warping events – that should have been fixed when Locke realigned the wheel. There should be a deeper, and probably more complicated reason, that the 06 had to return.
After all, they weren’t supposed to have left in the first place.
Yes, I agree with you that there are probably bigger reasons for them needing to return…I have a feeling it has something to do with this whole “Constant” business. I think they are each a constant for someone on the island (the ones now suffering from the bloody noses) and if they didn’t return, they would die like Minkowski or Charlotte. I think Kate is Sawyers constant, Jack is Juliet’s maybe, Hurley is…well maybe that theory has flaws…maybe they are all the island’s constant…and the island is hemorrhaging…yeah, that’s it;)
The image that popped into my head with “the island is hemorrhaging” was violent but amusing. Then again: there is a volcano…
I think that the island was going to be moved through time anyway, to save it from Widmore, but the 06 were supposed to be on it when it happened. They probably would have ended up in the days of DHARMA anyway, but it was necessary that they return to the island to do whatever it is that they’re meant to do. They didn’t miss out on doing anything important, they simply had to be on the island so that they could do it.
Ohhhh…that makes sense. Perhaps the reason they started skipping in time instead of moving just once (to Dharma times) was because the O6 weren’t there in order for it to go right…
maybe, either way you cleared quite a bit up for me. Thanks
maybe they need to change events like the purge. maybe they are needed to get the Others and Dharma to get along. the Others represent faith while Dharma represents Science. the show has a theme of science vs. faith, but it seems that they are supposed coexist
Maybe it is as simple as this: This is a story that has already been framed out. There is a beginning, a middle, and an end. But it’s like a rough draft. You Kind of know where you are going, how you want to get there, and how you want it to end. You know who the key players are, and will be. But then you have to think of it like a living, growing thing. The end-game is set. You know who has to be there. But how does that happen? I don’t think the o6 going back is neccesarily a way to fix the time-warping problem, but their return is neccesary to get to the end of the story… as has already been framed out. Destined. By whatever means there is predetermined end. Predetemined by who? The Island, or Jacob, or Richard, or by the writers themselves.
I love/hate to have to bring up Stephen King again ( sorry to anyone who has not read The Dark Tower series ), but that story seemed to transcend just fiction and the guy pennning it. It had a life of it’s own. There was an end that was predetemined, but the journey was like a living, evolving thing that almost seemed to manipulate the writer to it’s own desires (island anyone?). I guess this wasn’t exactly a simple explanation, had a couple of beers before I logged on. I could go on, but I will spare you.
Sorry about my spelling.
Just as Faraday said last episode about ‘that’s where we leave science behind’ re: the orchid station and Locke leaving the island to fix the skips; we now have Eloise telling Jack ‘that’s why they call it a leap of faith’ when he began questioning the plan to return to the island and the need to make it as similar to the original crash scenario.
It’s fairly clear the writers are needing to get well past the logical, grounded explanations and go further into the murky waters of science fiction to fully explore the grand themes of the show. We’re similar to Jack in that what he would have balked at in season 1 he now glibly accepts, it’s as if he’s finally realized he’s in this for the long haul and there’s not much to be done except hope it all makes sense in the end.
I really enjoyed the religious overtones and parallels between the series premiere. I noticed the gaps as mentioned in the comments, but can accept them hoping they will be explored in future flashbacks.
A tricky episode…the magician’s cameo is significant thematically in that the Oceanic 6 seem to be putting on a helluva magic show getting back to the island…Jack’s line to dead Locke about how crazy he must be putting his father’s shoes on Locke was classic.
To me, this is the episode that truly asks us to take a leap of faith. God couldn’t have asked for a better episode to guest star in.
Disagree completely.
The writers have been tossing quasi-religious references and themes at us the whole time. Think back to the speculation about the island being a purgatory. I think that these are no more meant to be believed than any of the other cultural/historical/literary references the writers have been making. The writers are using religious references to explore certain themes, but are not meant to be taken any more seriously.
Clearly everything that is happening on the island will be explained by purely physical/scientific (albeit imaginary) processes. The reason the O6 all had to return as they did was so that they could fulfill their roles in completing every temporal loop they have/will take part in. Two of them probably are Adam & Eve. They have to be there in order to found in 2004. The guitar case has to be there because the original was destroyed in the crash. Hurley has to be there to broadcast the numbers, etc.
I also tend to think (on a bit of a tangent) that Ben isn’t all that evil afterall. Manipulative, yes. But I think he actually is “one of the good guys.” Widmore is the villain. Ben has to do the things he does because he knows that he is in a closed temporal loop and that everything he does has already happened, or must happen, in order for certain future events of which he is aware to come to pass.
Some good thinking in there. Props!
Not sure I agree with Ben being the good guy. What good guy completely disregards the lives of others (i.e. When Jack asked Ben what was going to happen to the other people on the Ajira Flight)?
Good catch on the guitar Hurley brings being the one that Charley finds later?
Also going with the Ben being evil thing, maybe Ben is only helping the O6 complete their time lines to make sure the island stays intact. Then he is going to take control of it again when that happens…
I don’t think Ben can change what happens to people (or believes he can’t.) Ben somehow knows how everything will (or is supposed to) turn out, and everything he does is directed towards ensuring that does. As far as he is concerned, the moral consequences are irrelevant, since the outcome is predetermined.
Now maybe he’s wrong about how things have to happen.
And he’s certainly not my choice for humanitarian of the year. But if he believes that everything he does serves to bring about an inevitable conclusion, then I can see how he sees himself as the good guy, in contrast to his nemesis, Widmore.
That said, Ben almost certainly has another, self-serving agenda, and given Christian’s remarks to John, Ben might not have anyone’s but his own best interests at heart. In his own mind, though, I’m certain he believes that he is the Good Guy.
i think the reason everyone looks at ben as evil and selfserving is until this season we didnt really know he answered to anyone else, it felt more like he ran the show and only answered to, if anyone jacob. but now we know for a fact he is not the top of the totem pole. he follows orders as well. but yes, he is a mastermind and an expert at manipulation.
Charlie’s guitar wasn’t destroyed in the 815 crash. If you’ll recall Locke pointed out to Charlie that it was up in a tree. There are also scenes later on that show Charlie playing the guitar, therefore it couldn’t have been destroyed. I do like the rest of your thinking though.
Assuming, of course that that guitar case actually came off 815.
What I’m speculating is that the guitar didn’t survive the 815 crash, and that the one John “found” for Charlie was planted there. John seemed to know it was there. And like the Beechcraft and his injured leg, he seems to “know” about things when he’s already experienced them at some previous time.
I would assume Charlie would have noticed if it wasn’t his guitar, but I don’t recall there being any identifying marks or labels on it.
A guitarist knows his axe..come on.
They are saying Hurley from this time puts the guitar up in the tree for Locke to point out.
Who says that Hurley puts the guitar case in the tree? And seriously, Hurley climbing a tree, while carrying the case? Also, looking at both episodes, the guitar case in the tree has a white sticker on one side of it. The guitar that Hurley brings, then uses to keep him from sinking doesn’t have this sticker, so I’m still not convinced that it’s the same one.
Like I said before though, the rest of the theory makes as much sense as anything.
Was a good episode but definately not as good as the rest of the season so far. I’m not so worried about knowing how Hurley and co. were convinced to get on the flight, I have a feeling that his line “Dude, all that matters is I’m here isn’t it?” is as much as we’re going to get. The last thing I’d want is another episode faffing around showing someone changing their mind; don’t we get enough of that with Kate as it is?
P
I’m interested to see what happened to Ben – both when he was covered in blood at the marina and when/where he got to once the others returned to the island. We don’t know for sure whose blood that was that he was covered in…what does everyone else think?
Also, Mrs Hawking didn’t look all that fussed that Daniel asked for her help, does that mean she isn’t really his mum or that she is using him? Unlikely I know, seeing as we’ve spent all this time so far being led to the conclusion that she is related to him, but anything could happen on this show.
Oh, and finally; Frank shoulda kept the face-fur!
)
Maybe she wasn’t surprised because this has all happened before?
It wasn’t a very good episode, but it moved the story forward, and that’s good.
The best: Michael Emerson, he is absolutely awesome in all his scenes.
John 3:16 For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son,[a] that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.
John = Locke 316 = Flight,Episode ?????????????????
Apparently, the “Son of God” turns out to be Jack the christian shepherd, followed by his fellow believer John Locke who therefore will be resurrected into eternal life.
There are lots of hints like Ben explaining the painting (doesn’t that remind you of Jack’s surgery in Something Nice Back Home) to Jack in a Christian Church.
“John is going to be a proxy, a substitute.” “A substitute to whom?” “Jack – who do you think?” (short cutout of Ms. Hawking’s explanations to Jack)
Yea……I am not sure…His tattoo translates into (he walk among us but is not one of us). Also in the Preview for net week who is kneeling not to John when he is going to hang himself?
i thought thomas in that painting resembled widmore an awful lot
Does Jack turn out to be the son of god character, or does Locke think he should be? His suicide note read “I wish you had believed in me.”
Brilliant as always. I enjoyed the slower pace too. Season 5 has been absolutely phenomenal and I can’t wait to see what is in store in the latter half of the season.
QUESTION: Before they boarded the plane, Hurley fraked out when the lady was going to let other people on it. He said something there being no open seats because he bought them all. But the back of the plane was full of other people. Am I just remembering it wrong?
No, I was wondering this as well. Perhaps they were already booked on the plane before he had a chance to buy other seats? After all, they booked the plane just a day before take off. I’m sure other people were already scheduled for that flight, and then Hurley bought any other empty seats? I dunno…
So he just didn’t want any more people on the plane. Alright.
And I guess we don’t really know yet what even happened to the plane. Did it crash or did it just travel through the Island jump and the 06 just disappeared from the plane.
I think we have seen some of the results of the O6flash/planecrash in “The Little Prince”. My impression is that 316 crashed on the island in the present timeline (future for our protagonists).
Yeah, that’s sort of my thinking too.
The plane crashed in the “present” but the 06 got sent back in time with the rest of the Losties.
Ummm…based on the trailer after the episode it looks like Ben helped Locke hang himself…does this mean that Ben wrote the note that Locke purportedly left Jack???
Even though it’s only minor but it would be nice to keep such comments to yourself – some people don’t wanna get spoiled in ANY way, not even th eofficial previews!
Just a couple things I thought were awesome, and I haven’t seen mentioned…
- Christian’s shoes! It’s a small thing, sure, but people have been wondering since the first season why Christian is always wearing white tennis shoes. I thought this was a neat little reveal.
- Jack’s grandfather! I was just waiting for him to say something like “I used to make rabbits disappear a lot better than that guy could.” I’m wondering if he’ll play any big role in the future. And before you say no, keep in mind that Lost definately seems to have strong ties to family and it’s impact on the characters. I bet no one ever thought Christian would be playing the role he is now.
- The look on Sayid’s face when he starts noticing everyone getting on the plane…priceless.
- I love Locke’s suicide note. In my head, I could totally picture him saying those exact words to Jack.
Agreed.
The mention of Christian’s Shoes was awesome. Didn’t Darlton always tell us we would learn more about the white tennis shoes since the pilote had aired?
It was one of tonight’s many lovely recalls from Season 1 & the very beginning of the show.
I’m also convinced that we will see Christian’s dad again. They haven’t introduced him only for those shoes. The Christian/Shepherd dynasty still remains a central linchpin to LOST. Jack obviously is going to ascend the throne as the next chosen one.
Weren’t some of the Dharma experiments transporting Rabbits too! Or, making them disappear.
Did it strike anyone else very strange that when Jack asked Ben, “How can you read?” He replied, “Because my mother taught me.”
Didn’t his mother die at his birth in the woods of Oregon???
I think it was just a joke.
I think that was just some kind of joke.
good point to bring up, i never thought of that. Rremember little Ben did see his mother on the island, so maybe that’s where it happened?
i don’t know. with his mom dead, why would he even joke about it? maybe there’s more here, maybe not…
Yeah, Ben doesn’t have a morbid sense of humor at all…
Ben was in his boyhood when it was Dharma time on the island. I guess we’ll soon find out how he learned a couple of things besides reading and who taught him!
Oh, and lets not forget that ALL of the O6 did not make it back. Aaron is still out there, according to Christian, “Exactly where he’s supposed to be.” So the O6 were never supposed to leave except for Aaron? Maybe they were all supposed to leave just so Aaron could. Will he ever make it back to the island? The psychic in season 1 said he could never be raised by another and sent Claire on flight 815 so she could raise him (or so we’ve thought), maybe he really did see the family/persons in LA that he was “supposed” to be with. And poor Ji Yeon doesn’t have either parent now. Will Jin ever get to meet her?
I don’t think we’ve seen the last of Aaron.
Ji Yeon – I dunno.
This will lead to the next series, “The Children of Lost”, Where Aaron, Desmond’s Charlie, Ji, Walter, all try to find their parents.
Where was Aaron when Christian said that though? I don’t think he was on the rescue helicopter yet, so it’s hard to say whether Christian thought he should be on the island or off it. I think he wanted Aaron on the Island, myself.
For an episode that gave us so many answers, it was a snoozefest for one reason, and one reason only…way, way waaaaay too much focus on Jack. Even with all the crazy happening around him, this guy remains as condescending,arrogant yet startling clueless as always.
Ben, as usual was awesome, but even he couldn’t save this one from being pretty dull over all.
Next week looks very promising though!
I think the 06 in general are kind of boring – Jack chief among them. That seems to be the general consensus. But I did find Hawking’s explanation of Dharma searching for the Island to be pretty cool.
Jack’s best days are yet to come…watch.
Did anyone notice that when Desmond delivered his message from Daniel that Mommy looked none to pleased? She almost had a look of disgust on her face.
This epp was great with lines like “is he telling the truth?….probably not”, “My mother taught me”, and “we are not going to guam are we?”
It further cemented that Ben has his own agenda and does not care what happens to others. That Ms Hawking and more Know Ben is a liar, and more.
Where it Leaves us is where I suspect we will pick up and the epp preview for life and death seems to indicate. Locke will wake up on island and someone is going to talk to him about what happened most likely to judge if he is ready to be brought back to life. Also the “light house” is first acknowledgment that there were Dharma stations off the island….wonder if there are more
Also note Hawking said this is how the found it and the fact it still existed suggest that it was continuously needed, think food droop. I actually think the food drop at the swan happened in the 80s but due to time sits it arrived fresh when it did. Also the fact they can use computers formulas and such to find the island suggest that it follows a logical pattern. this would be no prob if it stayed at a constant time but moving through space and time would make it way more difficult to get to. So time there changes independently of the RL and when knocked off its wheel caused it to jump from time and place along its own path, I would guess that the people we saw flashing were actually jumping from times the island was physically at the same point makes daniels explanation of a skipping record alot more understandable. the needle is staying at same point just the record is moving, so the island was moving but the people were sitting still. Island time put back on track but on an older track so people now and have been stuck in the past…The entire 6 are needed now to move the needle back to the correct track on the record 
nice theory. It actually sounds pretty logical with what we know is going on now.
I have really enjoyed watching the subtle changes in Jacks character ever since he became addicted to OC and liquor. He is not the arrogant ass no-it-all he used to be and is coming to terms with the fact he has been looking at his life and the Island with a limited and short sighted approach.
Seeing Jack on the Island once again, fresh-faced and reborn, was exciting. I have a renewed interest in his character and am looking forward to see how his relationship to the Island will change.
One other thought, I think people are making too much out of Jack agreeing to Kates request to not mention Aaron again. We must remember that Jack lost Kate in the first place because he couldn’t shut up after Kate made a similar request for him not to ask about Sawyer. Jack is in Love with Kate and will do anything to be with her, look at his obsessive relationship with his ex-wife, which includes not making the mistake of pushing Kate to talk about something she can’t and in the process losing her again.
Also,
I found this episode to be very reminiscent of season 1’s “White Rabbit”, also a Jack centric episode, mostly because the tone, atmosphere and general weirdness were peculiar for a Lost episode; not to mention last nights overtone of Jacks family history and its importance to the Island.
I get what you’re saying about Jack agreeing to Kate’s request, but it’s still weird. I mean, Aaron is his nephew! How can he not care where he is? Or is he just too obsessed with getting back to the island that he chooses to not worry about Aaron right now? Still kinda lame…
My theory is that Kate is definely preggers. They had to duplicate as much as possible the original crash and well guess who gets to be the Aaron replica. I found it a little odd at first that Kate jumped on Jack like that, but now it makes sense. Not a good sign for any of the Saters.
Why is this particular 70-hour window the only one the O6 can use to get back to the island? Or is it not the only one, it’s just the only one Hawking has found in a long time (and she doesn’t know when the next one will be identified by the pendulum)?
Maybe Jin can now speak fluent English and Latin.