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Posted by docarzt on Wednesday, April 15th, 2009 at 10:51 pm - filed under Lost, Lost News - (116) Comments
Want TV News? Visit TVOvermind.comAfter the awesomeness that was “Dead is Dead,” Lost 5.13 “Some like it Hoth” landed like the final punch in a lethal combination. This time the biography went to Miles Straum, with a protracted expose on the corpse-whisperer’s well defined daddy issues. As usual, our own Clueless1der plunged into a stream of consciousness live blog of the festivities, and we’re here to hit the fine points and vote our consciences!
- Tons of number Easter Egg winks in this episode. Number references, white rabbit appearances, Star Wars geekisms.
- We got to see the Naomi recruitment which seemingly revealed without a doubt that the fake 815 wreckage was a plant.
- We saw the Swan construction site. Hurley tole Miles that it was responsible for the 815 crash.
- We met possibly a third group of players. People who know Miles past, and seem to have all of the answers. Whose side are they own?
- Hurley wrote Empire Strikes Back. Or would like to, anyways.
- Faraday is back on the island, as a scientist.
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116 Responses to “Rate & Rant – Lost 5.13 “Some Like It Hoth””
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Well. I thought the battle of the janitors was entertaining.
lol
Regarding the “third side”: these are the legendary other Others in other places.
I think this was the best episode of the season so far. My opinions tend to be the reverse of most other people, but I stand by it.
Nah, I totally agree. Empire Strikes Back references, confirmations of long suspicions, two stations under construction, and all around excellent banter between the two funniest characters on the show. I cracked up when Hurley suggested Miles and Chang get together for a beer, and commented on how funny it is that Chang’s son has the same name as Miles. Classic stuff that can only happen with Hurley, and is funner when someone as sarcastic as Miles (and as serious as Chang) is present.
So what does everyone think they’re digging for at the Swan: a unique electromagnetic anomaly like the one at the Orchid, or a hydrogen bomb encased in cement? Or both?
I would think both, though that would put my idea that Jughead is “in the shadow of the statue” in contrast. Unless the Swan is near the statue… my geography of the island is pretty much from the blast door map = pretty cloudy.
Uhhh…. Jedi ahead of A New Hope? Thats for another day I suppose…
Thank you. That was something that needed to be said before I could even comment on the episode.
Oh man… that is actually a mistake! It should have gone (from least to beast) jedi, a new hope, empire…. but don’t let that influence your voting…
Empire: THE quintessential(sp?) Star Wars chapter.
5th Element
Quint Essence
Quint Essential
Quintessential
Hope that helps -_^
WHy are ewoks getting the shaft tonight???? lol
I rated not very best, but pretty damn good!
I just want to say that the Ewoks are awesome, and I don’t care what Hurley says or what the writers think
Ewoks rock. They were always my favorite part because they look like Teddy Ruxpin.
Yeah, and you guys grew up listening to 80s Rock as kids, which is all that needs to be said.
GASP. I’ll have you know…. erm. Yeah, okay you called that. I still think Ewoks are awesome.
“Return of the Jedi” better than “A New Hope”? Who wrote this poll? You, doc?
It was a rock solid episode. Tons of answers, plus the biggest riddle of the season… What lies on the shadow of the statue, and who the hell are Ilana and Bram with?
My guess… these guys are a new, reconstituted DHARMA, and they are not so flower-loving this time around. Their leader? Maybe Eloise Hawking. She was the only one with enough time to put a large group of people in flight 316. After all, she chose it personally.
I like the idea that it is eloise hawking it definitly makes sense. I really like to think though that bran and illana have something to do with ann arbor and the degroots/alvar hanso. We know degroots/hanso have everything to do with dharma, but why would they want to get back now and how would knowing the riddle make someone “ready” to go to the island.
I also think that perhaps not only Widmore, but Eloise has “people” and that’s who Illana and Bram? Gram? may be working for.
The fact that they were unwilling to pay Miles to join their cause also says something about them, and whoever they are working for.
Yes, that they’re a bunch of poor fanatics driving around in a dusty old van. They probably are new in the business and spent all their resources buying that big metallic ark.
Hawking lives in a church, so…
But I think they may be some kind of new Dharma.
I just had a ephiney. Considering we got this miles episode so late in the season and the fact that we saw pierre chang in the first part of the premier is it that hard to assume that dr. chang is still alive and pulling the strings of illana, bram and co.
And if that is the case… God help us all. He does seem like a pragmatic, pitiless SOB from time to time.
I think everyone is looking way to hard into who this new group is. I think it is alot more simple, this is Farradays crew.He is the one who has been MIA this season until this new crew shows up, and he knows Jughead is buried in the shadow of the statuem and gave that as a code to his partners. Perhaps he is trying to change things so that Charlotte never goes back to the island on the freighter.
Yeah I was saying this after last weeks episode, because Widmore war was end of S. 4 and they wouldn’t do it again. What I said after “dead is dead” is Chang and Faraday got their message (the comic-con video) to the future and in the hands of new Dharma. They are now sending people to the Island to reclaim their right to the Island and maybe get revenge for the purge.
Or is just the people from Ann Arbor. And is logical they would know only Widmore and not Ben because Widmore was the leader of the Others during the war with Dharma, while Ben only became a big player after the Purge.
Or they realize that Ben is not the player he was and they don’t see him as a threat.
The what lies in the shadow of the statue seemed to imply danger eg “then you’re not ready to go.” Gotta be Jughead right? Or is that just so obvious that its setting up getting the rug to be pulled out under our feet.
I was thinking jughead since last episode although isnt jughead GAME OVER for like….. EVERYBODY! Nonetheless its rational to me. I mean w/ all the underground stations and vents and a few shiny suits from the magic silver ark a small group should be able to survive.. Hope smokey is radiation proof.
I don’t think it would even need to be used. A lot of people say the Korean war ended early because they saw test footage of the Atomic Cannon and just decided they wanted no part of that. Simply possessing the weapon with the threat of being able to use it would keep your enemy from doing anything overt against you.
Hear me now and listen to me later: the “Incident” will be caused by Miles coming into physical contact with himself. Remember the rabbits. . .
That’s an excellent thought. MILD SPOILER (only if you don’t watch the scenes from the next episode aired after the weekly shows) I thought the incident might happen right now, when Dharma discovers that our future friends aren’t who they say they are. Our look into “The Variable” in two weeks looks like a small war may be started. That seems worth mentioning in the history of the island. I guess we’ll see.
Why? Wh-wh-why? What does physical contact have anything to do here? Miles was in the seventies in the proximity of both his ma and pa, and probably they carried around the germs of little Miles, so, in a sense, he got it touch with himself. I don’t know, they’re not the same entity… they’re quite different. There shouldn’t be any rule about that.
I definitly agree, if they pull the whole same matter cant be in the same place parodox it would be kind of lame. The only reason we could reach this conclusion is because of the rabbit vidoe- which a rabbit was conviently placed in the beginning of the episode- I do think though that dharma is not willing to find out what would happen if big miles and baby miles occupied the same space. They are probably goin to find out these people are from the future and find out that baby miles and big miles are the same person and just completly blow a top.
So now we are getting our time travel “science” from Jean-Claude Van Damme movies? Are you kidding me?
Place a cup on a table. Now place another cup exactly were the first cup is, without moving it. You can’t. That’s what it means that “Matter cannot occupy the same space at the same time”. Time Cop threw the word “Same” onto the front and suddenly a lame plot device in a stupid Van Damme movie somehow becomes a foundational rule of time travel.
Please explain to me the scientific principle behind the mutual self destruction of a time traveler that touches himself? Uh, OK, that didn’t sound right.
No, I base this theory on the fact that the Orchid orientation video had to have been made after the time our Losties are currently in. It clearly shows Chang in a completly built Orchid station. When the second #15 rabbit appears, he knows there is a reason not to let them touch. Therefore, I presume something he’s witnessed in his past (our Losties present) gave him this knowledge. I doubt he (nor myself for that matter) have ever seen TimeCop.
I was criticizing the concept, not your conclusion. The idea itself is inexcusably retarded and absolutely devoid of reason. A logical black hole if you will, from which no coherent and sensible ideas can escape.
So, just so I’m clear, you think that the concept behind Chang saying the rabbits shouldn’t touch is incoherent. Not trying to put words in your mouth if I got it wrong.
Am I wrong in thinking that Naomi essentially confirmed that the planted wreck was NOT Widmore’s doing? I gathered from what she told Miles that Felix (the corpse) was on his way to give Widmore evidence of the cover-up–pictures of empty graves, a purchase order for an old airplane, etc.
It was possible that he was just returning that information to Widmore, after having done it himself. I don’t know Widmore would want that information anywhere near him though…
Maybe the 3rd group planted the plane?
I think it was obvious Widmore did the job. The guy was just getting back with the purchase receipts and the photos of the job done (the bodies dug up and all that) when Ben’s agents got the documents and killed Widmore’s guy. Those are the same documents Tom showed to Michael back in New York, in “Meet Kevin Johnson”.
Yes.
maybe
Disagree. If you mastermind something that large and outrageous, the last thing you want is a mountain of evidence on your lap. Haven’t you done something illegal?..haha. Felix was bringing the evidence to Widmore to show him that the plane didn’t really crash and the people didn’t all die, like the news reported….further justifying the freighter folks to launch their mission to the island.
Allow me to correct your phrase: If you mastermind something that large and outrageous… YOU WILL have a mountain of evidence. It was a gigantic operation and Widmore had people like Felix controlling it from afar. Felix was just going to see Widmore to show him how the operation was a success. If you are powerful enough to pull that out, carrying around a bunch of document in a file is not that dangerous. See Naomi’s face, she already knew about the documents… but if the documents were stolen by Ben’s people, wouldn’t she be a little bit surprised to her that… for the first time?
Widmore was responsible for the planted wreck. He was the one who knew beforehand that Oceanic 815 would (probably) crash on the Island…. he was the one who sent Abaddon to see Locke and convince him to go to a walkabout in Australia.
Ben, on the other hand, was quite surprised to see the plane crash, and had to make quick contingency plans with Ethan and Goodwin. He didn’t have previous time to assess the situation.
Widmore was the one who planted the fake plane crash.
It was a 9. Then Hurley started talking about Star Wars at the end, it it turned into a solid 9.5
… geek.
I have to admit. Before tonight, I thought all of that “Shadow of the Statue” stuff was nonsense and the new survivors were meaningless. Then we see that guy in the van who was on the plane, and we know he’s not working with Ben since they didn’t know who he was. This is definitely a 3rd group. It does make sense that they’re working with Eloise, but what exactly is she trying to do?
We don’t know for sure he’s working with Ben…
not* workng with Ben…
But Eloise seemed to know just who Ben was at the Chapel. Didn’t she warn Jack about him again, that how could he be trusted? So if the Newbies work for her they would have to know about Ben.
Of course, could just be poor leadership on her part.
Jacobs Lather says:
April 15, 2009 at 11:56 pm
Am I wrong in thinking that Naomi essentially confirmed that the planted wreck was NOT Widmore’s doing? I gathered from what she told Miles that Felix (the corpse) was on his way to give Widmore evidence of the cover-up–pictures of empty graves, a purchase order for an old airplane, etc.
—
I figured that this Felix guy was supplying Widmore with the ways and means as to gather the required goods (dead bodies, airplane) in order to stage the crash. Therefore Widmore was confirmed to be the orchestrator of the fake plane wreckage (at least thats what I gathered from this, gotta watch it again!)
—-
DarthBubba says:
April 15, 2009 at 11:55 pm
Hear me now and listen to me later: the “Incident” will be caused by Miles coming into physical contact with himself. Remember the rabbits. . .
—
Definitely picked up on those clues as well (the rabbit statue hiding the key) however I feel like that might end up being an anticlimactic “incident”. maybe not…
i do this that the reason why candle/chang kicked his wife and baby miles off the island (as per Miles mother) was to avoid any such incidents of adult miles and baby miles interacting with one another (upon adult miles telling chang that he is infact his son) in order to avoid a cataclysmic and paradoxical rift in time/space !!
Or Chang “kicked” them off the island because he’d become privy to knowledge of the upcoming purge like we saw in the infamous Comic-Con video.
GREAT idea as well!! But, you hear Chang yelling at his wife to shut the baby up, so that vid was still made during the 1977.. so im thinking that since the purge doesnt happen til the 90s(?) that perhaps that wouldnt be raeson enough to “kick” them out so soon.. we’ll have to wait and see AHHH
I think this is the most probable scenario. Miles mother didn’t seem like a lying woman, and Chang with the baby didn’t strike me as a man not concerned about his son.
I think that is most likely.He knew of the purge and decided to get his son off the Island.
“the rabbit statue hiding the key”
Maybe what lies in the shadow of the statue is THE key. What that means remains to be seen, but that statment made by thesmokemonster just blew my mind!
what did smoky say? I’m confused
Got it, nevermind.
Is it wrong to believe that what lies in the shadow of the statue is the FDW and the ability to time travel?
that sounds a little bit to complicated for the answer to a riddle. It would also be cheesy as hell if illana asked someone what lies in the shadow of the statue and someone said, “uh, a frozen donkey wheel” Who knows though, i dought everyone calls it that, the only reason we call it that is because it was the name of the finale’s twist.
I would put my money on the more simple answers that have been floatin around like: the rope, the well, the swan, or maybe, just “the island”. No idea though. got any ideas, lets get a list goin!
How about, “what lies in the shadow of the statue”,
“Cerberus!!) I think this would be awsome. The only person we know of that has called the smoke monster, cerebus, has been radzinsky. Afer what we know about rads now is it hard to assume that he staged his suicide and skiped the island for whatever reason. Maybe he is the one that is now controlling bram and co. I know its a stregth because kelvin said he buried his body, but i dont know im a huge radz fan and i think it would be sweet as hell.
I really like the idea of it being smoky. The visual of smoky lying down, or cowering, or kneeling, what-have-you, in the shadow (or AS the shadow) of the statue in servitude or reverence is appealing.
Chris in Fort Worth
yeah it would be cheesy that’s why the answer to the riddle(?) is not a thing but an allusion to something else.
Atlantis, the Island, lies in the shadow of the statue.
That simple.
The 70′s dharma touches were pitch perfect this episode, deft and played for the right amount of detached laughter, yet imminently creepy for obvious reasons.
First the hilarity of Ben’s 20ish rug last week, and now Miles’ punk look and his sad dying mother’s dreadful hair. Keep ‘em coming.
I initially dug Horace and his friendly disposition, but once we landed in the past he’s become an intolerable jackass.
Did anyone think for a slight moment that Jack was going to make Roger Linus shutup by opening up a lil can of fightin’ Jack?
I always imagined the statue of being little importance to the overall story, a (sorry for this) footnote ; /
Now it appears the statue and what lies beneath it are of great significance. How close is the Orchid to the Statue? Is it possible the FDW is being referenced?
Has anyone seen an updated island map lately? I would love to see all the locations that we now know on a map.
Chris in Fort Worth
I thought the “Temple” lies in the shadow of the Statue? Did’nt they see the back of the Statue when they were time shifting? and were they near that wall where Ben said it was to keep people like you out” but that they were still a a few mile away from the temple?
I agree that it could be the temple and Jughead is also a viable option. I believe that the orchid is far too obvious. The shadow from the statue, when it was whole, would have stretched for miles and feasibly could encompass a huge portion of the island (and even the sea).
How about “Man” lieing in the shadow of the statue. This makes me think something along the lines of; the island uses man for its own bidding and reason, but in no way does the island answer to man.
They were next to the Orchid and the frozen donkey wheel, but I question whether this is of literal significance. Most likely it is an allusion to being ready for something or a part of a group; maybe both.
All the Hurley talk about Star Wars made me think the same thing I thought about that Friends episode with Brad Pitt as a guest….. “these writer sure know their audience.”
What I really want to know is what, exactly, does Hurley change for the better in his version of Empire?
Nothing. Hurley ALWAYS wrote Empire Strikes Back.
Hilarious!
I like to think he’s the one who got the screen time for Bossk, IG88, Zuckuss, 4LOM etc.
Yes!!!!!
More Lando Calrissian
Decent episode. favorite scene was the construction of the Swan and the stamping of the numbers into the hull.
could Felix have been the guy we saw Widmore beating the snot of in that video he showed Locke?
I thought that too…
The video that Ben showed Locke..
Not really, the guy being beaten up in the video was one of Ben’s people. Felix was going to deliver documents to Widmore, hence, working for him.
Well maybe this is in part why widmore beat the snot out of him cos he found out he was giving info to Ben as well.
so, what happened to the body that miles/hurley were toting around? why did it have to go to chang so badly? also, why was the swan built on hostile territory?
Because that’s where the electromagnetic pocket is…
They needed the body to see why he died. If it was electromagnetically related, which it clearly was.
Don’t really remember the skull with the bullet hole that clearly from the mass grave… do the holes match up to this guy? Could it have been a dumping pit for bodies even before Ben/Others used it after the Purge?
My thoughts are that the bodies we saw in the episode explaining the Purge with Ben and Locke, are just people that died on the island, such as this guy. The Purge actually never really happened and the dead bodies are staged.
The primary reason I liked this episode was just the character development of Miles, particularly his relationship with his father. As far as the mythology goes, it seemed to offer almost nothing we didn’t already know or assume. Every “reveal” was already predicted by anyone who has read these boards since the beginning of the season. It was still fun to watch, but until Faraday’s appearance there really was nothing unexpected. Even seeing the Swan being built did nothing for me.
Yeah, this episode was full with confirmations and answers only,… except the confirmation of the Bram/Ilana Co. being part of a third team with access to heavy info about the island and no money. Most people here still thought they were Widmore’s minions.
But now they’ve been labeled as third group (or bunch of crazy fanatics) two things come to everyone’s minds: 1. new DI 2. Eloise Hawking. Maybe even both.
i have reason to believe that Ben is aware of these people even if they are not individually aware of him and that they are working for the economist, who i do not believe has ever been absolutely exposed as Charles Widmore. I think the writers brushed that one by us, as we never really got that much information from the Sayid-Ben backstory and we’ve all independently concluded that: Ben was working against Charles Widmore, ordering Sayid to kill “his” men > One of the targets says she works for an Economist > its logical to think that all of the targets on Ben’s list would be Widmore’s cohorts > thus Widmore must be the Economist, right? Maybe not…
Two things to keep in mind however.
1.) In the episode Eggtown last season, Miles is confident that Ben can allocate him 3.2 million dollars… No more, no less… We all fell all over ourselves for months over that figure (Why 3.2? A 3 a 2 and 5 zero’s? 325? The Bearing?!? The amount of passengers on Oceanic 815 plus Aaron? or was it plus Christian!… bahh)
Well in this episode it becomes clear(er) Naomi, per Widmore, offers Miles 1.6 mill… he asks Bram for double. Does that mean that Bram and Ilana (and possibly Caesar) work for Ben? No. They threw him outta the van. But it is worth feeling your beard over…
2.) It seems obvious that the Shady Statue Liars are neither Ben’s nor Widmore’s. We can rule out immediately that they aren’t Widmore’s as they are attempting to persuade Miles away from Widmore’s team. We want to rule out that they aren’t Ben’s either, as Ilana claimed to not know who Benjamin Linus is (which I believe was a bald-faced lie.) That leaves the possibility they are working for the remnants of the Dharma Initiative (the most obvious alternative, especially conisdering the themes of this summers Comic-Con) or possibly agents of Eloise Hawking (who although she resides in a Dharma Station at present [the lamppost] her dialogue “the dharma initiative USED this station to find the island” leads one to believe that she is not nor has she ever been aligned with the dippy zen scientists from Ann Arbor. Also, if you believe that the Economist has still yet to be identified, it is not outside the realm of possibility that that title refers to the man pulling the strings behind the DI, Alvar Hanso.
I think “what lies in the shadow of the statue” is whatever the Frozen Donkey wheel is attached to – On the other side of the wall – that the workmen in episode one of the season under the orchid kept melting bits from- I think its antimatter/black rock/alien dark matter – and its what allows time travel and has the potential to cause the end of the space time continium.
The white rabbit is the key to why Chang kicked wife and baby miles off the island.
Just watch the ending of Southland Tales to see what happens when the same matter (Sean William Scotts) tries to occupy the same place – An immense amount of energy is released. . . The comic-con video with Chang and the Orchid station tests alludes to the seriousness of the future rabbit coming into contact with it’s present self. I don’t think Big Miles touching Baby miles is the Incident however – Its just one reason for Chang sending his wife and baby away from the island. The other reason is Faraday tells him that the purge is coming and he sends them away to protect them.
The incident will have to do with the Orchid and the dark matter/anti-matter/black rock inside the center chamber(On the other side of the frozen donkey wheel). Just look back to the episode one of this season – Chang says don’t drill any farther or the energy that “allows time travel” will escape and cause potentially catastrophic results. The writers will neatly tie this season up. The first and last episodes of the season are connected. . .
Typo I meant to say – Big Miles touching Baby Miles ISN’T the incident. . .
The Other Others – “Children of the Smoke” – have to be an Eliose Hawkings splinter cell. They all seem to have bloodlines/ties to the island and a better spiritual understanding of their roles – Maybe even super powers. We know that Miles was probably born on the island, as was Ethan.
Does spending childhood on the island cause one to develop super-powers?
It seems so in Miles’ case. I think we shall see in season six with Aaron, Jiyeon, Charlie Hume and Walt.
My prediction is that there’s a drills and digging equipment in the in that big crate with Ilana.
I don’t understand why everyone is putting forth Miles being born on the island as accepted fact now. This is LOST! Until you see an event occur any other possible explanation could be in the cards….
Plus, the DI Dr. told Sawyer that the DI usually ferries the preggos OFF island for births in 1974… that would be pre Miles birth, so why wouldn’t they do the same for him. Because Ethan and mommy survived? hmmmm….
Am I the only one who finds it hard to believe that the Hostiles wouldn’t notice/hear a giant construction site in the middle of their territory?
Other than that, I loved the episode.
Oh, one last thing, do people believe that Hurley really talks to dead people a la Miles or are they just hellucinations? I think the latter.
I would lean towards NOT hallucinations, mainly because some of the hallucinations drove Hurley toward getting back to the island and it seems to coincidental that they’d be doing the same work the island is doing- forcing the people back. Also, for the fact that that other asylum guy told Hurley that Charlie was staring at him. Maybe the guy talking to him was a hallucination too, but that’s so different from the nature of all the other visions, that I’m inclined to think the other guy really saw him too.
I think he talks to them, but as they discussed in the episode, in a very different fashion from the way Miles talks to them. A hallucination would only be able to provide information that you already new, and Hurley’s been obtaining new information from the people he talks to. However, it may be possible, that he’s not actually talking to those people, but rather, something else that takes the form of people he’d recognize (a la Colonel Clink to Homer Simpson)
Since Faraday was off the island for quite some time in the 70′s it’s likely he and his Mommy set up the Lamp Post station and later recruited children of the DI that were sent away before the purge (like Miles). This is the group that went along for the ride on Ajira 316 and will challenge Widmore for control of The Island.
I absolutly love that idea! How cool would it be if we find out bram, illana, and co. Are currently in the DI as babies or young children. The ages would pretty much match up (i think) and maybe it does mean they might have some type of powers. At some point before the incident or before the purge the children and mothers are sent home. Or maybe the incident will involve the others taking all these children away. Just rambling now, this probably doesnt make any sense.
While I believe that Mrs Hawkings/Daniel represent the best option of who Ilana & Co work for since she knew exactly which plane to be on… etc…
I want to throw out 2 more possibilities because:
1. they have money & 2. they have a dislike for both Widmore & Ben.
The first is Penny. She stated to Ben in “Dead is Dead” that she and her father are not exactly seeing eye to eye. Something tells me that we have not seen the last of Desmond & Penny and both have passion and the means to pull off a third party interdiction.
The second is Sun. She seems like she does not know what is going on but in reality she has already secretly pulled off taking control of her father’s company. Sun blames Widmore and Ben for separating her from Jin and she also has the means and is sneaky enough to pull off something of this magnitude.
I could be wrong… since its a stretch and sometimes Lost disappoints me by actually going with the obvious. So, I’m just throwing this out as food for thought.
Good idea, Sun has the money, Penny probably does as well if Widmore used the Island to get rich.
But if Penny’s involved that would mean she is keeping something from Des and I just don’t see that.
It would be cool, though.
Remember that besides Sawyer, Juliet, Miles, and Jin… Sun and Sayid (and Jin) previously saw the statue in the second season when on Desmond’s (err Libby’s) boat…
After last night’s episode, I have to reevaluate who’s bones are actually in the pit. Rather than bodies from ‘the Purge’, Perhaps they are the bones of the dharma construction workers who either died from radiation poisoning (Jughead) or from the island’s magnetic properties ala the body Miles was moving around.
. . .or there are more empty graves elsewhere in the world.
Why? Wouldn’t the people from dharma BURY their dead workers?
The corpse pit was made by the hostiles. Check the skeleton’s uniforms… regular uniforms, not blue ones like Alvarez’s.
So Ben was lying about them being the corpses of the purged people since he showed it to Locke in season 3 and outright told him they were all the DI and they were purged?
Doubtful.
Yeah, Ben lying is doubtful to the umpteenth degree.
Ben being innocent and a good guy even more likely?
What happened happened, okay?
The show revealed Ben’s involvement and actions in the purge (and probably his idea as well based on what we’ve seen between him and Widmore and Alex).
The purge happened.
Not arguing with the premise. Just saying… saying something is definitely wrong because Ben wouldn’t have lied about it is not sound reasoning.
I’ve been leaning this way a few episdoes now. I’ll go even further to say that Ben comes back and re-examines the action of the Purge and our Losties are now back to stop it from happening and the dead bodies of the natural deaths are used to stage the future Purge so that it actually never happened. I think that’s what I mean. I can’t figure out the logistics or how it was done. I have a headache now.
Personally I think it’s too early to say who, if anyone for that matter, this new group of shadow statue worshippers is with.
Eloise is unlikely to me as we’ve seen her working with Ben, Desmond, and the O6, and these new arrivals seem as if they are going to throw a wrench into the main casts gears next season.
I believe the Ajira 316 people are going to challenge the Others outright for control of the island, the coming war that Widmore prophesied to Locke. As we know, Widmore has been incapable of returning to the island, even though he’s tried as we learned from Dead Is Dead.
Because despite all that has happened between Linus and Widmore, ultimately their battle has been a “dispute among the ranks” for leadership. Ultimately they both have the same goals as they are both Others, but these new people obviously are not Others. They know about the island, the statue as well, but other then that they don’t seem to know all that much else.
I don’t even think I could comfortably call these people a DI revival. Offering enlightenment and knowledge seems more mystic then scientist. Not to mention the DI had their heads completely up their own asses. They call the Others hostile, so far the DI has been more violent and “savage” then the Others.
Overall at this moment, based on what I know and have seen, this new group is the faction in the upcoming that has no ties to any seen group so far. Eloise wouldn’t do this, she’s too tied into the current players to hire an outside faction, Widmore already made his move and it failed, and the DI are done for.
ok so i think that the other group might have some relation to the smoke monster i mean if they have no ties to ben, whitmore, eloise, or the DI, then maybe it is the island itself calling the children who left the island durring the purge back to itself to save it from the ben/whitmore war
I think that adult Miles will somehow cause Baby Miles to gain the ability to talk to the dead, and that Faraday will save the day like usual.
N A O M I I S B A C K , T H I S A L O N E M A K E S I T T H E B E S T E P I O F T H E S E A S O N ! ! ! ! !
SHE IS HOT(H), AIN’T SHE?
miles wants 3.2 million not to go to the island,
the same amount he asks ben for,
so im thinking miles at least thinks those people work for ben
Michel said:
It was a gigantic operation and Widmore had people like Felix controlling it from afar. Felix was just going to see Widmore to show him how the operation was a success. If you are powerful enough to pull that out, carrying around a bunch of document in a file is not that dangerous. See Naomi’s face, she already knew about the documents… but if the documents were stolen by Ben’s people, wouldn’t she be a little bit surprised to her that… for the first time?
Widmore was the one who planted the fake plane crash.
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Sorry, Michel, just had to address this further. Naomi works for Widmore. If her employer was the one trying to create the massive cover up, why would she tell Miles about it so casually? If it’s such a big secret it seems like she might be a little more careful about who she tells. UNLESS she was purposefully trying to trick Miles into thinking that it WASN’T Widmore, but that’s just unecessarily complicated. The only other explanation I can accept is that Naomi herself doesn’t know that Widmore is actually responsible for it. Again, though, I think that’s overthinking a relatively simple and straightforward coversation. The writers were not intentionally trying to mislead us here.
Very decent episode, funny, entertaining, and free of ugly SFX. Quite interesting regarding the show’s mythology though. I like it how old elements of the show are linked together, just simply, without phony explanations and storyline shortcuts.
Seems to me there hasn’t been much talk about everything that was on the chalkboard that Jack was cleaning in SLiH. (All of the egyptian context)
I only got to watch the episode once but the timing of these Egyptian easter eggs should be mentioned especially after Ben’s encounter with smokey last week. These EGYPTIAN clues keep coming up.